March 28, 2020 - 3:49am
Out Of Everything
Went to the store to make some bread sticks in the machine. The store was out of flour, yeast and just about everything else. Went to the 2nd store. Same story. Anyone else in the same boat?
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Went to the store to make some bread sticks in the machine. The store was out of flour, yeast and just about everything else. Went to the 2nd store. Same story. Anyone else in the same boat?
Flour can be ordered online, but shipping is expensive.
There is plenty of bread on the grocery shelves, so why the absence of flour and yeast? Makes no sense to me. I don't know people who bake their own bread, and I only do it on rare occasions. Can't be a "need" so must be a "want." Unlimited time of their hands and the need to try something new.
What would happen to grocery-store bread if 20-30% of bakers and bakery truck drivers got sick at the same time?
That's why people, who are not already normally stocked with flour and yeast, want the option of making bread at home.
The clearing of shelves is not necessarily due to "hoarders", all it takes is for everyone to try to buy one bag of flour and one thing of yeast, or one of anything, the same day or week. stores and their supplies and "the system" are not designed for "too fast" of a turnover. the system is designed for normal "spread out" shopping, that happens 99.99% of the time.
But yeah, there are hoarders, as with T.P. fer instance.
Dave, I almost always agree with you, but I call them “hoarders”. The hoarders cleaned out King Arthur Flour, the largest miller of flour in the nation. Think about it. How many people do you actually know that has bread baking skills of any type.
If people who intended to bake their own bread bought 1, 2, or 3 bags that would be fine. But King Arthur had to put limits on their products in hopes that they could meet the demand.
Tell me this. What are all of those hoarders going to do with the entire supply of USA toilet paper?
Maybe I am missing something, but as of now I think of them as hoarders. Buy what you need and even what you think you might need in the near future. But try your best to save some for the next guy. Might be tainted because I live in Hurricane Alley (south Louisiana). I’ve seen this every single hurricane, and I’ve seen a lot of them.
Sorry to go on...
Danny
Yes, there are some who buy way more than they need. Shame on them. And shame on the stores who waited two weeks before putting limits in place. The limits should have been put in place as soon as store management saw what was happening, by end of Day 2 at the latest.
But my point is that even without the hoarders, in times of hurricane, snowstorm, whatever, even if everybody buys "just one", the stores would still run out. Stores can't handle "everyone" buying "everything", "even just one of a thing" all at once.
So the bottom line: The stores would still run out. The hoarders just hastened it by a week.
My secondary point: banning the panic-buying/hoarding helps, but doesn't solve the issue. There will always be hurricanes and snowstorms -- and people need to keep emergency food in their homes for when disaster hits, and the food supply chain is interrupted. The covid-19 virus may still disrupt the food chain if enough farmers, food industry workers, and truck drivers get sick.
"Joseph-in-Egypt" was the perfect example: stock up in good times to prepare for the bad. I don't panic if stores are out of TP for a month, because I still have a two or three month supply left, and I built it up (slowly) years ago, and merely "maintained it" since.
Another sin of the hoarders/panic-buyers, is that many of the stupid ones are going to hold on to the canned/bottled/dry food until it expires, and just throw them away. Food banks won't take expired food unless there is a life-and-death catastrophe going on.
I'm someone who maintains a good household stock year round. The last time I bought T.P. was Nov 2019. But, the thing is... I built it up slowly. I purchased when it was not a big deal to buy an extra package, or can, or bottle.
Then I rotate my stock, using canned or bottled food, or TP, or wheat berries, a year, 2 years, or whatever after I purchased them. So when I initially built up my supply of stuff, "put back" as the country folks call it, it was in the 2012-2014 time frame. And it was little by little, never buying an eyebrow raising amount, never taking a significant portion of the stock off the shelf. And ever since 2014 onward, my new purchases have been normal level, going into FIFO rotation. That way, "the system" has had 6 years of resupply to recover from my "extra" buying back in 2012-2014.
i don't eat just canned/botled food, only when I'm too lazy to cook. But, 6 months before the expiration date, if something is still on hand, I donate it to a food bank, or a church that has a food program. Then it serves TWO purposes, "catastrophe insurance" for me, my family and friends, and a charitable donation.
It is pretty common right now. I heard someone joke that " flour is the new toilet paper" in terms of things that people have started hoarding.
Lots of new bakers though! I think a lot of people have had bread baking on their bucket lists and are finally at home with time on their hands. This is the opportunity to give it a go.
I am reminded of "Christmas users", the "newbies" of the past.
1. try your local Indian, or other ethnic grocery stores. "maida" is a soft all purpose white flour. "atta" is a category name that includes both high extraction flour and whole wheat. "Sharbati" is a high quality smooth whole wheat flour. None of these are really good bread flours by themselves, but can stretch whatever higher protein bread flour you can find. They also usually have durum flour, both semolina and finely ground true flour. They are all good for flatbreads, muffins, etc, just about everything except loaf bread. But still can be used as partial ingredients in loaf bread. Though, with a good recipe and practice you could still use them in 100% WW loaf breads. (I've used a lot of high-extraction durum flour, and Sharbati.)
2. Try your local restsurant suppliers to see if they would sell you 25 or 50 pound bags. with many restsurants closed, they might have inventory. see http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/62291/experience-w-general-mills-50-lb-flour for names, descriptions, and part #s for all General Mills flour that is unbromated/unbleached and at least 11% protein. Yellow pages, and the General Mills web site (link in the page about 50 lb bags) will help you find restaurant suppliers/distributors.
What to do with 50 pounds? share. Go halvies with someone. They are cheap too. $21 for 50 pounds of King Arthur, if you go pick it up. (If a supplier carries General Mills, they will sometimes also carry KA and Caputo.)
3. www.centralmilling.com has 5 and 50 pound bags. They are in Utah, so shipping will be reasonable to Colorado. Has a HUGE catalog of 3 major categories: Organic, non-organic (Red Rose label), and Sprouted. The Red Rose non-organic has EXCELLENT prices. And people on this web site RAVE about CM's quality. Buy 50 pounds, and share/sell/split among friends, family, and neighbors. Also has many non-wheat grains and flours.
Bon chance, amigo.
What about yest? Has any tried places like Amazon? Do they sell stuff like i need?
Amazon is reported to be back-ordered. But check yourself, as the situation can change daily.
I saw the 1/4 ounce (7 gram) packets at an Aldi grocery store, in Indianapolis, wednesday, Mar 25th.
You mentioned a bread machine, which generally uses 1/4 oz (2-1/4 tsp) of yeast per loaf. Making dough by hand, and using long ferment times, you can get that down to 1/4 tsp per loaf. (Even 1/8 tsp with whole wheat.) So there's 9 loaves per packet. See www.youtube.com/artisanbreadwithstev (no final e) for some easy-peasy recipes.
I bought a 3.5 oz seasoning size jar of yeast for $2.99 at a local Indian market. Brand name, "Hans". It seemed slow to rise, so maybe a bit old or different than American brands. I would double the yeast in the recipe next time or at least increase by half. Think of the frozen unbaked yeast rolls in the freezer. They can break open the package in no time once thawed!
Best part, this 3.5 oz jar only $2.99!
An anecdote: the top 5 recipes in the NYT early this morning were:
1. No Knead Bread
2. Pancakes
3. Pancakes
4. Dutch Baby
5. Crepes
Everyone is looking for a way to use up all that flour! :|
No Need bread? Nice to know that all the missing flour from the shelves is getting used. I hope all the panic buying stuff that doesn't get put to good use at home ends up at the local food pantry.
When I was at the Costco in NKC, MO on Thursday, they had the 2# bags of Red Star active dry yeast in depth. They also had a skid of Great River all purpose flour in 10# bags along with some bleached AP flour in 25# bags. I was at a Kroger affiliated store yesterday where they had both Pillsbury and Gold Medal AP flour on the shelf and some Hudson Cream white whole wheat. I can't predict when we'll ever get back to what we knew as normal before the CV but it does look like the supply lines are slowly starting to find enough product to fill some holes on the shelves at the grocery stores. The best I can say is to shop early and shop often.
has mentioned how difficult it is to buy butter in the quantities he needs for his croissants. Some of his customers are purchasing butter on his behalf to keep him supplied.
Paul
Not to high-jack the thread, but did Mark Sinclair move back to the States? He was in Spain, and perhaps his decision to return home was a matter of unintended great timing with the rapid spread of the virus around Madrid.
much to the delight of his customers that were sad to see him move to Spain.
Paul
So Mark schlepped that mobile bakery rig back here? I had assumed he had it shipped to Spain but maybe not. Regardless, he's probably better off, though no less appreciated, in rural Montana than in Spain about now.
Thanks for the update. Wonder if he'll get his camera rolling again. His videos were inspirational.
Tom
You can find Sinclair's Bakery on FB and follow Mark's posts there. His croissants are still amazing.
Paul
I placed my first-ever order 3-4 days ago. Timed it right as the truck is due to arrive 2 miles from my house on Tuesday. Free shipping unless you have it sent parcel post, but you must meet the truck. We'll see how it goes with "distancing" and safe shopping. Azure had a few kinds of flour in 10llb bags (also larger), I got more oats, and will try my first yogurt starter. Wishing everyone good health! Karen
"Costco is stripped clean" said a friend. I did place a order from Amazon, back ordered till the first. Great!
Found yeast at the Indian market. I don't know if it is old, or just the difference in how it is made and packaged, but I found I need about twice as much for bread baking as I ever had in the past.
If you have ever purchased frozen yeast dinner rolls like "Rhodes" then you know that you can't have too much yeast! Those rolls will explode the package if left overnight to thaw! My recommendation, more is better!
Did you browse the flour aisle at the Indian grocery? If so, how much and what kinds? What city? Thanks.
I’m in Toronto Canada and the stores I’ve been to and all sold out of the most common flour brands here such as Robin Hood. I haven’t seen a bag of flour in a supermarket in over a week.
I hope that the bulk barn still has a supply otherwise I’m going to be out fairly soon. Living in an apartment where there isn’t much space for storage, I cannot keep much extra of anything including flour. I can only buy a few pounds at a time and it is also difficult to have very many varieties of flour on hand as well.
Hopefully everyone has stocked up now and when new stock comes in it won’t sell out quite so quickly.
Benny
I was able to get hard white bread flour and whole organic spelt at the Bulk Barn today, I spoke with the employees and they said they are trying to keep everything in stock so that they're ordering larger quantities from suppliers where they can. They were only completely out of a couple of flours including whole white bread flour. For Torontonians looking for flour I'd say have a look at the Bulk Barn.
Benny
Went to the store at 6:00 A.M.No good. White flour (In small amounts) oil and not much else. Yeast should be here in about a week or so. (So said Amazon.) Can't find an what I need in any type of store. Great.
My Aldi, in Indianapolis, has yeast packets.
Would Iodized Salt make any difference in recipes as to plain Salt?
If you are "land locked" it makes even more sense to use iodized salt. Your plain salt isn't iodized?
Whew! For a minute there I thought you couldn't find salt and was starting to wrack my brain for sources!
We can still get everything we need here in Austrian stores. Even TP. I do wish hardware and home depo type stores would open. Put these couch potatoes to work fixing things and painting things. All the florists are closed and that means all those little baby plants and flowers are homeless!
I'm one of those peope who thinks he can taste the anti-caking agent in processed salt. It's almost always in there with iodide.
But, there is also "iodized sea salt", and I think I had a container of that which did not have the anti-caking agent.
I end up using a mix of 1/2 Himalayan salt, and 1/2 processed commercial salt that has iodide.
Mini is right, If you're not getting seafood, an iodide supplement is necessary. I want to get just a bit more than what's in my daily vitamin pill.
--
Be advised that iodized salt has an expiration date, because the iodide evaporates. The salt (sodium chloride) will still be there, but the iodide slowly goes away.
This article about Canadian grain shipments was in our news today.
” Canadian grain is in high demand as shippers try to feed a growing appetite from mills and governments seeking to shore up staple reserves amid the COVID-19 pandemic.
Grain shipments at the Port of Thunder Bay in Ontario doubled year over year in March, with vessels loading 200,000 tonnes last week and higher volumes expected to continue, the Chamber of Marine Commerce said.
"Right now, we expect April grain volumes to be above normal. We currently have 650,000 metric tons of grain in storage ready to go out and we are receiving more rail deliveries," Thunder Bay Port Authority CEO Tim Heney said in a release.
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Related StoriesRichardson International Ltd., Canada's largest grain handler, says demand for wheat and durum at flour mills and pasta plants around the world is on the rise as customers stock up on staples, partly in preparation for extended lockdowns triggered by steps taken to contain the novel coronavirus.
"Demand was already up in countries like Italy which had a smaller crop last year but with the COVID-19 pandemic, some countries are ordering extra wheat and durum to increase their reserves and satisfy this new demand," said Carsten Bredin, who runs Richardson's grain merchandising.
Canadian National Railway Co. chief executive JJ Ruest said earlier this month that demand for grain has been particularly strong over the past month.
Shipments of the bulk product will likely stay "solid" at least through May, despite sagging container volumes and potential layoffs at the railway as global supply chains wobble, he said.
"The month of April will not be as strong as the month of March," Ruest said on a conference call with analysts, referring to total freight volume. "As we go on, we're going to be parking more equipment, we're going to be parking more rail cars."
Wade Sobkowich, who heads the Western Grain Elevator Association, said strong demand in Europe and Africa is a welcome follow to a tough year that saw rail blockades, mudslides, labour action and a late harvest depress traffic of bulk goods.
"The re-opening of Thunder Bay and the St. Lawrence Seaway is critical in order to supply food to the world, and to keep as many people employed as possible during this difficult time," Sobkowich said.
Containerized grain, which includes chickpeas, beans, lentils and other "specialty crops" bound largely for India and China, are dropping along with other container shipments, however.
The decrease stems from a lack of available containers and a shortage of export slots, said Doug Mills, Vancouver Port Authority, a senior account representative for bulk commodities at Vancouver Fraser Port Authority.
"When the COVID issue showed up in Asia it resulted in significant production loss. Factories were slowing if not shutting down...and as a result the flow of cargo coming to North America was slowing," Mills said.
The shutdowns prompted container lines to cancel sailings, resulting not only in fewer clothes and electronics arriving at terminal bays, but also fewer ships to haul Canadian products back across the Pacific Ocean.
"If the ship doesn't come in, we've got nowhere to put an export container," Mills said. "The flow of containers is out of sync."
This report by The Canadian Press was first published March 31, 2020”
The shutdowns prompted container lines to cancel sailings, resulting not only in fewer clothes and electronics arriving at terminal bays, but also fewer ships to haul Canadian products back across the Pacific Ocean.
"If the ship doesn't come in, we've got nowhere to put an export container," Mills said. "The flow of containers is out of sync."
Hopefully, it is only a temporary condition. If not, the end-consumer eventually gets the product, but at a higher price.
(And also hopefully, there will be donations to buy and ship grain to East Africa, which is suffering crop loss due to the locust plague.)
a) If a buyer wants food bad enough, they'll contract with a shipping company to send a ship to pick up the cargo.
b) If the seller wants to sell bad enough, they'll contract with the shipping company to send the ship.
c) If the shipping company, the ship's owners, don't want their ships sitting idle, they might lower their prices a bit to encourage a) or b).
Hopefully, there are reserves of food on the buyer's side, and space for more reserves on the seller's side, to ride through the temporary unbalanced situation.
"Kan-ban", or "Just In Time" (JIT) inventory control is a bitch when there are emergencies.
This is as bad as trying to find rye flour. No luck as of yet on that too. Would plain salt affect the taste of your bread?
you will definitely taste a difference.... for the lack of salt. :) Better to use it than not use it.
Salt is important for regulating yeast fermentation and tightening protein bonds.
Today, I got a bulk package of yeast. It say, " SAF-Instant". Is it ok to use for Bread Machines? Do I use it any special way or just dump it in like normal?
So dump it in like normal. You can seal up and freeze a portion of it and it will keep for years.
Get to baking
If i put the yeast in the freezer, do I need to thaw out first before I use it?
No, use it straight out of the freezer. I buy SAF yeast by the pound. I just checked Amazon. My yeast was purchased in September 3, 2014. I vacuum pack most of it and leave out a little to keep in a ziplock. Both live in the freezer.
My yeast works great, even after 5 1/2 years old.