DOVES FARM FLOURS - I need advises
I found out recently that some Doves Farm Flours are available in a store in my country (in a different town, not the one I live in, but the manager offered me free shipping, so it is a reasonable price for me).
I need advises from those of you who used these flours. Available right now are
(1) organic strong Wholemeal bread flour,
(2) organic strong White bread flour,
(3) organic wholegrain Spelt flour,
(4) Organic Wholemeal Rye Flour, and
(5) Organic Plain Wholemeal Flour.
I want to buy the first 4 from that list. BUT... I noticed that organic strong white bread flour has on the list of ingredients vitamin C, Calcium carbonate, Iron, Thiamine (Vitamin B1) and Niacin. I want to ask you if this flour is good to feed my starter (I feed my starter now with bio german flour 550- but is not always available) and how is this flour compared to french T65 -taste, water absorption, etc
I'm grateful for your answers.
codruta
Hi, Codruta
I personally haven't used their flour for feeding SD, but I know a lot of people do, from reading another bread-related forum (UK based).
T65 is not easily available in UK, so not sure there're lots of people who can give you the comparison between them in UK. I've recently started using T65 my daughter's got from Paris, but I've never used Dove's white bread flour myself, so I'm sorry I can't help you in that.
This wasn't very much of a help, was it....Sorry. :p
lumos
Lumos, all the good flours I used till now, have a tendency to disappear from the market (they are bio, are expensive and people don't buy it- so the stores don't import them anymore). I used german 550, italian 0 and french T65. I loved them all. My starter loved them. Now I find myself in an unpleasant position: I only have left a bag of german 550, and after that...??? I need to find quick another good flour, for both bread and starter. Doves Farm have a high price (~ the same as the above mentioned ones), but I'm willing to pay if I know that is a good flour. That's why I seek advise.
:) your answer is not very helpful... but you are so kind to take the time to write me :D thank you.
codruta
As an ifo, Dove's flours is generally highly regarded by lot of home bakers among the flours you can easily get from supermarkets. So they are good flours. Dan Lepard has a forum with lots of UK based posters, so if you post a question there, probably you can get more answers. I know some of them use Dove's regularly.
Dan Lepard Forum
.................................is this slightly more helpful? :p
lumos
hi there,
sorry afraid I'm not going to be of much help either as I've only ever used their rye flour (no. 4 on your list). That one is very good.
None of the flours on your list apart from the strong white contain any added vitamins or minerals (probably because they're all wholemeal?) so if you're happy to maintain your starter on a wholemeal flour and only refresh it with whatever flour you'll be baking with, go with that.
Off top my head, added iron and calcium may not be good for your starter as metal ions will usually inhibit the growth of bacteria and yeasts. Presumably the mill only adds as much of these as is lost when bran is removed, but I'd guess that added metals will be more bio-available than those bound in complex organic molecules within the grain berry, and therefore will more easily react with your starter. HOWEVER that's only my speculations so don't take my word for it.
@Lumos: There are no useful information on Dan Lepard Forum (and if they are, I did not found them), only questions. :(
@ FoodFascist: I have my starter for more than 2 years, and I always fed it with white flour (usualy french T65, or german 550). I don't want to start feeding it with wholemeal flour. But I'll be careful with the new flour, make a test and see if my starter likes it or not. If not... I'll see then.
I think Chuck and Andy have already answered your question below, but what I'd suggest (and have suggested above already) is if you can't find an answer you're looking for on a forum, get yourself registered and ask the question yourself. That's what that sort of forum is for. And I can also tell you that some posters on that forum DO use Dove's flour for sourdough.
lumos
Lumos, I know you ar right, and I thank you for you suggestions. I appologize if my previous answer could have been interpreted as ungrateful. I assure you that it was not the case, and I really appreciate your time and contributions.
I am registered there, but I never used the forum. (and in this matter I did not had much time, cause I had to decide pretty quick if I want the flours or not- and I decided that I want them, and they are on the way to Timisoara- I should get them on Monday :)
best wishes. codruta
It's OK. :) You know what you wanted to know now, anyway, and that's what matters. ;)
kind regards,
lumos
Just a note for all of you that
"Calcium carbonate, Iron, Thiamine (Vitamin B1) and Niacin"
are added to ALL white flour in the UK by law. When the Second World War ended people apparently demanded a return to white bread. The Government gave way in the early 50s, but insisted on certain vitamins and minerals being added to compensate for their loss as a result of using white flour as opposed to the 85% extract used in the War.
Very best wishes
Andy
[Edit] I posted at the same time as the post above, so neither of us saw the other post until later. Oops. The post above is more accurate and thorough and more specific to UK lingo. In light of the above post, this one is rather pointless.
vitamin C, Calcium carbonate, Iron, Thiamine (Vitamin B1) and Niacin
These trace elements are completely normal in white flour; you've used them all the time (probably without even knowing it). The idea is that milling white flour removes too much of the vitamins, so "put them back". The process of putting things back is called "enriching".
Whether to call each of these things a "vitamin" or a "nutrient" or something else seems to be mainly an accident of history. While I don't know anything specifically about "Dove" (or "organic"), my guess is that any bag of white flour you look at will say "enriched".
Hi Chuck,
Probably a language difference but we don't use the term "enriched" in the UK in the way you describe.
In a baking context enriched would usually refer to all those goodies that we like to add such as butter, eggs etc. It has nothing to do with putting things back as you suggest.
The correct term in the UK is the one I used: "fortified". They ARE vitamins and minerals, that is no accident of history, and they are added on account of white flour returning to favoured use after the war, just as I suggested.
As I explained, these are all added by law.
Best wishes
Andy
Thanks, Andy. When I created this content, I was sceptical about those fortifications- but things are very clear now. Thank you, again.
What about vitamin C? What is its purpose, what effect has on dough? Do you think I can feed my starter with this flour, or should I save my bag of german 550 for the only purpose of feeding the starter?
codruta
Hi Codruta,
When added as manufactured Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin 'C' is included in the formula as a strengthener within the Improver.
To put it in context, the maximum permitted amount under UK Regs is 200 parts per million on flour [ ie. 0.0002%]
It is very common in many types of bread, and often used by French bakers in particular [at a lower rate] and is ubiquitous in British commercial breads generally [there are some notable exceptions]. It is now the only permitted additive in this category in the EU, apart from enzymes, which manufacturers don't like to, or have to, tell you about!!!
Whilst it is scarcely necessary to include it, it's not exactly top of the list of the more scary substances added to our food. And, it is pretty effective stuff too.
Sorry, Chuck...seems like our posts were uploaded at the same time, so you didn't catch what I had written first.
Best wishes
Andy