September 7, 2024 - 4:33pm
LoafNest vs Challenger Bread Pan
Hello,
I have a convection oven at home, and the convection can't be turned off. Steaming is a pain. I finally figured out how to manage it with an aluminum cookie sheet and inverted large steel bowl. It works for steam but I don't think it helps much with radiant heat at all (light material). I am thinking of springing for one of these two:
Challenger has great reviews. LoafNest is cheaper, and enamel means no rust. However, it is too new, only 2 reviews. Does anyone have experience with either? Thanks.
Share
Hi GV, I am the creator of LoafNest baker [ so may be somewhat biased ;) ]
You are right in noticing the advantages of enamel and easy steam insertion. Enamel also makes it really multipurpose for baking pretty much everything including acidic foods like lasagna which will not work with bare cast iron. Also the movable tray makes the workflow a lot easier.
Apart from this, I think the major difference is the weight. We choose a mid-way weight that is heavy enough for radiant heat but not too heavy to manoeuvre in the kitchen. We achieved this by using a 2.5mm thick steel (compared to ~ 5mm for cast iron). So LoafNest inTune weighs around 15 lbs compared to 22 of Challenger.
We soft-launched the product in a couple of week ago (and hence the two reviews) but we have been making unique bread making products for a while now [https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07B7BB4PY ]
Give it a spin, currently we have some discounts going on (message me if you can not find them) at Amazon.
On this thread I will also be happy to answer any questions you may have about product development or running a small family owned business in the area of breadbaking equipment.
It is not meant as a promotion of anything. Just a honest effort to share our experience and knowledge that might be hard to come by if you are not a product developer.
Would you consider providing your product to people who post reviews on YouTube? I'm thinking specifically of the following:
Foodgeek | Amazing sourdough and world food recipes
The Perfect Loaf | Bake Sourdough Bread
Gluten Tag to theBread.code(); (the-bread-code.io)
Of course, we would love to send out free samples to people who have a reputed blog/YouTube. If you are reading this and have a bread/baking related channel/blog get in touch via email [info at wekigai dot eu]. Or if you want to recommend our product to any of the creators you know, that would be great too.
Often, many creators see this kind of work as commercial partnerships and expect an upfront renumeration. That makes sense for large companies or investor backed companies with a marketing budget. For a small, self-funded and niche company like ours, it does not really make sense to spend 2-10k on such 'placement' so we have restrained from doing so in the past. Word of mouth from our customers has typically been enough. Of course, sending out a test sample is something we are always happy to do.
Thanks. Three questions, hope you can help!
- Will it hold 2 Demi-baguettes or 2 Ciabattini? (I know there's no "standard" size for these, but I hope you get the idea).
- Can I bake a wet dough (Ciabatta, Focaccia) directly in the LoafNest? Will the high hydration dough coming into direct contact with Enamel do something bad to the pan? (eg warp, crack, etc because of sudden cooldown effect?)
- My favorite go-to loaf pan is 10" long x 5 inch wide x 5 inch tall. The loaves I make can be up to six inches tall from the base. Would that fit in the LoafNest?
Thanks!
When we made this product, the target was to be able to bake 3 demi baguettes of 'decent' size (in addition to a 1 kg boule or 2x 500g batards).
So we made it 30 cm (12 ") long inside.The width calculation went like this: 3 baguettes of 5cm/2inch width + 3.5 cm for water tray + 9cm clearance between baguettes and for handling. Total 27.5 cm in width. The height is with a target of 6 inches. The thickness of material, handles on side and top and the requirement to fit in most typical ovens determine the overall dimensions.
In the end inside dimensions are 30cm x 27.5cm x 14.5cm (or 12 x 9 x 5.8 inches).
So, I think the answer to your first and third question, I would say the answer is yes (assuming 0.2 inch on the height does not really matter).
About the second question, yes, you can directly bake wet dough in the pan. We rigorously test and make manufacturing specifications on thermal shock, so it should not be a big issue. You can easily transfer a parchment paper with ciabatta or pan de cristal in to a pre-heated pan. We have tested this and it works well.
However, on Foccacia, I think you would bake from a cold pan that would start heating from outside so I am worried that the pan-side will cook/burn too soon while the top is still heating. You may be able to overcome this partially by pre-heating just the top before baking and by using a slightly lower temperature on your oven. But I must admit we have not tested this. We just bake Foccacia in a pre-heated LoafNest using a standard oiled thin-gauge Foccacia pan. If it is of any relevance, we have baked lasagna very well starting from a cold pan.
Hope I have been able to give some more insight into the design and use.
Thanks for the info. I ordered a pan. Will post an update in a few weeks.
Hi GV, I am curious if you got a chance to use your LoafNest what was your opinion on design, performance and ease of use.
I bought a LoafNest pan and baked a loaf in it. I also baked another loaf from the same batch of dough using a Challenger pan. Following is a comparison of the two pans. I'll abbreviate LoafNest with LN and Challenger with Ch.
I made a basic sourdough bread from the Foodgeek's website. Hydration is 70% and the dough uses a mixture of bread flour and rye flour. I've made the recipe several times before.
To line the LN a piece of parchment paper cut to the size of a one-quarter sheet pan fits perfectly into the baking rack. (The paper can be removed when you remove the lid in the second stage of baking..)
After preheating the pan, you have to remove the entire LN pan to place the loaf into it. With the Ch, you need only remove the top. I find the LN more cumbersome than the Ch for this purpose.
I find the single knob on the top of the LN more difficult to use than the two handles on the Ch. The knob on the LN provides less clearance at the top than the handles on the Ch. The lack of clearance makes it more difficult to lift the lid off of the base while baking.
You can simply invert a loaf in a banneton directly onto the LN's tray and then score it. With the Ch, I have to invert the banneton onto a peel, then score and finally slide into the base of the Ch. This makes the LN less cumbersome than the Ch for this purpose.
Ovenspring and crumb: About the same with either pan. Clean-up also about the same.
The Ch pan provides more baking area than the LN. I didn't find the LN's built-in thermometer all that useful. Both the LN thermometer and my oven's gauge read the same. If another oven gauge is less accurate, then the LN thermometer might be more useful.
Overall, I found the Ch pan easier to use. That may be due to me having used the CH many times and the LN just once. If you don't already own a Ch pan, then the less expensive LN pan would be a good choice.
Thanks for taking the time to share your experience.
I am particularly pleased to hear that the crust and crumb were same in both pans, in spite of LN being about 70% the weight of CH. Thermal mass is not a bottleneck for baking performance beyond a point (according to our calculations) but it was good to have that validated also with the user.
Thanks again!
Replace cookie sheet with a baking stone or steel, you'll need at least 20x14x3/8. Replace bowl with a full-size 6" hotel pan, go with lighter gauge, you need barrier, not thermal mass. It will be much cheaper, just as effective as far as steaming is concerned, and baking area will be much larger.
Personally I also steam with cast iron pan and lava rocks on top of that, but with forced convection it's probably pointless.