The Fresh Loaf

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rate my challah

drloafmd's picture
drloafmd

rate my challah

Hi everyone! I'm a newbie in the bread baking game-- I've only made challah so far and would like to improve upon it before trying other recipes. I'd love your feedback on how my challah looks, and maybe some help troubleshooting flavor issues.

Question 1: Does this challah look right to you?

Question 2: What can I do to get that eggy challah flavor?

The first time I made this recipe, I got the flavor down, but the bread was really dry-looking, the crust was too thick, and the crumb was super dense. 

  • Misread recipe and used 1/4 cup 105ºF water instead of 3/4 cup!!
  • 6 cups all purpose flour all at once, and added quite a bit during the kneading process 
  • Canola oil
  • Used brown sugar throughout
  • Active dry yeast
  • 4 eggs straight from the fridge
  • Threw loaves in the oven without foil, steam, which is prob why it was so tough
  • Bulk fermentation: 45 min, 2nd fermentation 30 min, then braided and rested 1 hr 
  • Wonderful flavor, but very dense

This time, the texture was wonderful and pillowy (though I probably should have left it in the over a little longer for a tougher crust), but the flavor wasn't quite there! 

  • Used ~1 cup ~105ºF water 
  • 6 cups King Arthur bread flour, used very little flour during kneading
  • Olive oil, not extra virgin 
  • 1/2 cup honey, 1/2 tbsp brown sugar to start the active dry yeast
  • Active dry yeast
  • 4 eggs straight from the fridge
  • Covered loaf with foil for last 15 mins, shiny side up, to help make softer
  • Bulk ferm: 1hr, 2nd ferm 30 min, braided and rested 1 hr
  • Eggy flavor not quite there, but very light and fluffy

 

 

I'm not sure what changed. Maybe I need to use more honey? Did olive oil throw off the flavor? Use a mix of bread flour and all purpose flour (I've seen quite a few recipes call for a mix of the two, why's that?)

Question 3: The recipe I've been basing mine off of asks for 8-8.5 cups of flour while I can only fit ~6 before my dough feels way too dry. I live in San Francisco, so is humidity the culprit here? (See below) Is this a dough I should use a mix of bread and AP flour for?

--

From this New York Times Cooking recipe

  • 1 ½ packages active dry yeast (1 1/2 tablespoons)
  • 1 tablespoon plus 1/2 cup sugar
  • ½ cup vegetable oil, more for greasing bowl
  • 5 large eggs
  • 1 tablespoon salt
  • 8 to 8 ½ cups all-purpose flour

 

--

Lastly, from the bottom of my curious heart, thank you for any and all input! :) 

 

Lechem's picture
Lechem (not verified)

You've got a nice crumb and sheen. The recipe looks like a typical challah recipe. Not sure if I've ever heard of using olive oil though. Depending on how much used I couldn't say if that effected the flavour or not. I'm just saying it's not a typical oil for challah.

The flour mix is to get the benefit of the strong protein in the bread flour and the soft crumb of the AP flour. Too strong and the bread will be chewy. Too soft and the height will be compromised plus a crumb that's too cake like. So it's often mixed for a balance.

I haven't done challah much at all but I hear that Maggie Glazer's recipe is popular. Here it is with volume and weight measurements. Weighing will be more accurate...

https://www.finecooking.com/recipe/challah

Stuart Borken's picture
Stuart Borken

I am reformed so I often make a dairy challah.  To convert the recipe I recommend using water and additional margarin to substitute for the fat in the whole milk I use.  I wish I could send photos of my breads but I can't figure out how to do it with my cell phone and iMac computer.  My e-mail is stubeee@aol.com if you want to contact me for photos.  stu borken  Here is my favorite recipe;  it makes 2 1 pound loaves, we eat one and a half each friday night and one family takes home the remaining half for the weekend.  My recipe reads like "War and Peace" because I give a lot of technique and prep information, so don't be put off at the start....... 

                                         CHALLAH DAIRY from Stu Borken

HAVE READY;

Tilt head KitchenAid Stand Mixer

Kitchen Aid whisk attachment

Kitchen Aid paddle attachment, rubber edges

Kitchen Aid dough hook

3 Pyrex custard cups

2-cup volume, Pyrex measuring cup

Nesting bowl, 10 ounce one

Spatula to scrap down dough from dough hook as it kneads dough

Bench scraper

Spray Bottle with water

King Arthur unbleached bread flour-1 2/3 C 

Italian Style Flour; caputo "00" flour-1 1/2 C or all bread flour

Salted butter, 2 tbsp, melted

Fine sea salt-1 tsp

Lactose free milk-3/4 C

Red Star Rapid Rising yeast-1 1/2 tsp

Clover honey-1/4 C

White Sugar-1/4 C

Yellow food coloring-4 drps (this is a secret it makes the bread just a little yellow, optional)

Eggs, 2 extra large, warmed in a tall glass of warm water

Egg, smaller one for egg wash of risen loaf just prior to baking

Pastry brush for painting loaf with egg wash prior to baking

8” X 8” cake pan to hold water to help humidify/steam oven during initial baking

Sesame seeds

Parchment covered baking sheet

2 damp towels

“Shower cap” to cover dough during 1st rise in nesting bowl

 

 

If you make it parve, omitting all dairy…use water in place of milk & the dairy free spread called “Smart Balance”, 3 tbsp. (2 tbsp to replace the butter and 1 tbsp to replace the fat which would have been in the whole milk) .

You do need to understand dough texture, which comes with experience and maybe working with an experienced bread maker.  The dough needs to have the gluten developed and the dough texture soft but not tacky.

 

2 CUP PYREX MEASURING CUP;

3/4 Cup whole milk, Stu uses lactose free, warmed to 110-degrees+1/2 tsp sugar to feed the yeast

1 1/2 Teaspoon rapid rising yeast, Red Star i.e.1 packet yeast proofed in the warm milk 

 

IN A PYRIX CUSTARD CUP;

2 Tablespoon salted butter melted in the micro 

4 Drops yellow food coloring added to melted butter, optional, for eye appeal only

 

 

IN A PYREX CUSTARD CUP;

1/4 Cup clover honey, a little over flowing is just fine maybe even better

1/4 Cup white sugar, rounded is good

 

IN A PYREX CUSTARD CUP;

2 Eggs, Extra large, warmed in glass of warm water, cracked into custard cup check for blood/shell

 

IN A BOWL LARGE ENOUGH TO HOLD THE FLOUR AND SALT;

1 2/3 Cup King Arthur unbleached bread flour + 3-4 extra tbs needed to get dough texture perfect.  The technique for measuring flour is dip, scoop and shake to level then pour it into bowl.

1 1/2 Cup King Arthur, Italian Style Flour, Caputo “00” flour not needed if you don’t have it, if you don’t have it use all bread flour

1 Teaspoon table salt, or fine sea salt added to flours, not Kosher salt it is not the same texture and therefore not the same amount of salt for the taste

 

IN PYREX CUSTARD CUP;

1 Whole egg, scrambled for egg wash 

 

Sesame seeds or poppy seeds, optional garnish onto the egg wash dough prior to baking

 

OVENS;

1) Baking oven needs two racks. One in middle, one below it to hold 8 X 8 cake pan with 1 inch boiling hot water to steam oven during the first 15 minutes of bread baking.

2) Warm proofing oven for the first rise of the dough in the

proofing bowl. This same oven will be used for the braided dough

to rise. It is my experience that an electric oven be used so

as to hold moisture when you spray the oven to keep the oven

moist for the rising of the braided dough. The wet interior of the

oven allows the surface of the braided dough to expand as it

proofs. I has been my experience that a gas oven evaporates

the humidity which you need.  You create the oven humidity with a spray water bottle.

If you don’t have a wet oven the dough will form a hard dry crust and not do an oven rise.

 

 

SPRAY WATER BOTTLE;

Spray water bottle with distilled water to spray the oven.  Distilled 

doesn’t leave a residue on the walls or floor of the oven.

 

TILT HEAD SMALLER KITCHENAID STAND MIXER;

Set up the small tilt head KitchenAid stand mixer with wire whisk in place. 

Make your proofing oven warm to 110-degrees, KitchenAid oven or Brod & Taylor proofing box

 

BREAD RISING BOWL ( MY NESTING BOWL 10.2 OUNCE)

Oil a bread rising bowl and weigh it.  

In another bowl, place the two flours, the sugar, the salt and mix with a spoon.

 

When yeast proofs, pour it into the KA bowl and add the warm

eggs and honey. With whisk in place, turn on KA to a setting of 2 and whisk.

 

Then add the melted butter with the yellow food coloring, and

whisk to mix well. Remove the whisk.

 

Pour flours with the sugar and salt into the KA bowl. 

Replace the whisk with the paddle, I use the rubber edged one which scraps the bowl edge. Put the spatter guard on the bowl.  

Turn on and off in quick successions , less than a second, or flour will fly out.

Us the spatter guard. Mix to wet the flour well, then an additional minute or two longer.

Test the dough with your fingers, if you think it's too tacky add

a tablespoon or 2 of extra bread flour, It should be a perfect

bread dough at this point. 

Remove the paddle.

 

Place dough hook in place and knead for 5 minutes, stopping

the mixer and scraping dough off hook a few times.

 

Using a curved bench scraper, remove dough from the KA bowl, place it onto a wooden board

(the dough should be soft but not sticky and no flour should be

needed on the board or your hands, if you do need some, of

course, use it, then knead it for a few minutes to further develop

the gluten. Shape it into a ball and place into the oiled bowl turning

over once to grease it. Cover the bowl with shower cap or plastic wrap, not touching the dough.

Weigh this bowl with the dough inside it.

Subtract the weight of the bowl from this total weight. You now

have the dough weight. You will want to divide this weight by 3 or 6, depending if you are making one large challah or 2 smaller ones….3 braids for each bread. 

Place bowl and dough in proofing oven or Brod & Taylor proofing box at 100-degrees,

to double. It will take a couple hours to double. When the dough doubles, it's

risen enough. 

 

After the dough has risen enough, using a plastic bench scraper,

remove the dough onto a kneading board. If you are making one

2 pound loaf, cut into three equal weight sections. Each section

will be a rope for braiding. Use your kitchen scale. Cover the

dough sections with a damp cloth for 5 minutes. I usually make

2, one pound loaves, so I cut the dough into equal weight half's

and then cut each into equal thirds (5.2 ounces is what each rope weighs).

 

Prepping a baking platform:

You can prep whatever baking platform you want to use. I like

a double bottom cookie sheet with a parchment which I lightly

spray with non-stick spray. I find the Silpat mat too small for 2 loaves. I

don't use corn meal on the baking surface because some of my

kids said they don't like the gritty texture. 

If you are going to make only one bread then prep a double

bottom cookie sheet with a Silpat mat. You may sprinkle just

a small amount of yellow corn meal onto the mat, but that is

only for appearance, the bread will not stick to the mat of

course. The mat is too small for 2 one pound loaves

 

Working with one 5.2 ounce segment of dough which you will

use as one of the ropes of the braid, gently flatten each piece,

into a rectangle. Take the left side and fold to 2/3 across to the

right. Take the right side and fold 2/3 to the left. Pat this down

again flat. Turn this 90-degrees and then stretch this rectangle

to about 8 inches long, (I have, at this time, used a rolling pin

to elongate and flatten the dough) then from the edge closest

or farthest from you, you start rolling up this rectangle, pinching

down the rolled edge, until you have rolled up the entire log then

seal the final seam by pressing with the heel of your hand. Roll

this log to 12 to 14 inches long, fatter in the center and tapered

on the ends. Rest the logs on their seam side. Cover them

with a damp cloth. Allow to rest 5 minutes then make each one

the same length. Then roll each log, if they are at all wet or tacky

add in just a small amount of flour on the bread board so as to keep

the final braid ropes separate.

 

There are two ways to braid;

1) You can lay one rope of down and cross another in the center

of the first one and then lay the third over the two and braid to one

end then braid in the other direction and pinch each end tightly together

 and tuck under.

 

2) Lay the three ropes side by side and TIGHTLY pinch one end

together and begin tightly braiding from that end. Pinch the final

end together and be sure to tuck under. Tuck the beginning end

under as well. If you don't tuck the ends under very well the braid

will unravel as it rises and unravel even more as it bakes...so be

certain to tuck ends under very well, you may need to wet your

fingers to get a good seal of the ends.

 

Lift the braided loaf(s) and place onto the Silpat mat or parchment.

Be certain the loaves are straight. Place the dough into the proofing

oven. Spray the oven and the dough with a spray bottle with lots

of water. Rise for whatever time it takes to rise to a loaf about

double or more than what it started at.

 

Part way thru the rising, start to preheat the baking oven to 350F.

Place the 8"x8" cake pan with hot water into the baking oven on

the lower of the two shelves.

 

At the end of the loaf proofing remove the pan with the dough to

your counter and let it rest about 2 minutes to get a slight drying

of the crust to help support the brushing on of the egg wash.

Paint the bread with egg wash. You may garnish the egg washed

dough with seeds on the rounded risen lobes of the braids.

Then gently place the baking sheet onto the baking oven at 350-degrees 

and spray the oven and dough with LOTS of spray.

 

Allow to bake for 15 minutes and then remove the pan of water.

Set timer for 6-8 minutes. At the end of 8 minutes, this should be the end of the baking.

It will have a huge oven spring. The bread should be light to golden brown.

Take the loaves off the mat or parchment with a long spatula

and place onto a cake rack to cool.

 

If you wish, you may test the bread with the instant read

thermometer, if it has reached 185-190 it's done. Allow it to

totally cool. It will take about 4 hours.  Makes one very large 2 pound loaf or 2 one 

pound loaves.

 

Stuart Borken's picture
Stuart Borken
Stuart Borken's picture
Stuart Borken

challah

dabrownman's picture
dabrownman

traditional Challh recipe here

http://www.wildyeastblog.com/saffron-challah-for-breadbakingday-04/

Even though this recipe has instant yeast instead of sourdough it can easily be converted to SD for an even better challah for those who really love tradition.

For me Challah has to have saffron in it or it isn't Challah.

Happy baking

 

drloafmd's picture
drloafmd

hi everyone,

 

i tried again with canola oil and the flavor was much better. i also let 1 loaf freeze for ~16 hours, thaw for 5-6 hrs, and for the last 20-30 mins of proofing, accidentally left it on top of the preheating oven. it got super warm super quickly and completely bloomed. i mean it grew 150%. In a panic, and in fear of the bread turning alcoholic, I threw it into the oven and let it bake for about 46 mins at 350º. The result was this super voluminous, chewy, and eggy bread that is definitely my best attempt yet. 

I've also decided to switch to weight measurements for good. This time, I used a little over 6 cups of flour total: 4 cups bread flour, 2+ cups unbleached all purpose. But now I don't know the specific amounts! so it's time to go metric.