Hokkaido sourdough milk bread
For this bake I followed the recipe that Melissa shared on Breadtopia.com a couple of years ago. It has been on my list to bake for a long time after having made a yeasted version a long while ago. A couple of challenges I had on this bake was using my niece’s starter which needs some work to boost and then baking in my in laws’ oven. However, despite the very slow fermentation the end result is really good.
For one loaf 9x4” Pullman pan
Ingredients
Sweet Stiff Starter
• 53g bread flour
• 24g water
• 18g light brown sugar
• 18g sourdough starter ~100% hydration
Tangzhong classic 1:5 ratio
• 89g milk (adjusted down to 1:5 ratio from original)
• 18g bread flour
Dough Dry Ingredients
• 360g bread flour
• 59g sugar
• 7g salt
• Dough Wet Ingredients
• 139g milk
• 59g egg beaten (about 1 ⅕ of a large egg)
• 67g melted butter Soften but do not melt if you are hand-kneading and see the instructions at the end of this recipe.
Total flour = 431 g
Total weight 899 g
Instructions
Starter
Mix the starter ingredients in a jar or pyrex container with space for at least 50% growth. (See gallery where 150ml grows to approximately 225ml.)
Press down with your knuckles to create a uniform surface and to push out air. This reduces drying and allows you to see actual CO2 aeration over time.
At room temperature, it typically takes 7-9 hours for this sweet stiff levain to be at peak.
Tangzhong
In a sauce pan set on med-low heat, whisk the milk and flour until blended. Then cook for several minutes until thickened, stirring regularly with a spoon or heat-resistant spatula. Let cool in the pan or, for faster results, in a new bowl.
Dough
These instructions are for using a stand mixer. Scroll to the end for hand-kneading instructions if you do not have a mixer.
In the bowl of a stand mixer, briefly whisk the dry dough ingredients, and then add the sweet stiff starter, separating it into 5-6 portions as you add it to the bowl.
Now pour/scrape in all the wet ingredients (including the tangzhong), with the melted butter last. With the dough hook attachment, mix on low speed for a minute, scrape down the sides, and then mix on medium speed for 15-20 minutes. The dough will seem very soft, but as you approach the 15-20 minute mark, it should not stick to your hands and should pass the windowpane test.
Transfer the dough to a lightly oiled bowl, form it into a ball, flip it smooth side up, cover and let rise for 6-12 hours depending on room temperature. If you refrigerate the dough, plan for longer rise times. See photo gallery for approximate dough expansion during the bulk fermentation.
Prepare your pans by greasing them or lining them with parchment which is what I usually do.
Cover and let proof for 2-4 hours (more if you put the dough in the refrigerator). I proof until the top of the dough comes to within 1 cm of the top edge of the pan.
Preheat the oven to 350F and brush the dough with the egg-milk wash.
Bake the rolls uncovered for 30-35 minutes, and loaves for 50 minutes or until the internal temperature is at least 190F. Cover if your rolls get brown early in the baking process.
Remove the bread from the oven but not the pans, brush the tops with butter while hot, and then let cool for 10 minutes before pulling the bread from the pans. You may need to slide a butter knife down the sides of the pan to loosen the bread, but I have found parchment paper to be unnecessary.
After the bread is completely cooled, store it in a plastic bag at room temp for a week or longer.
Instructions for kneading by hand
Mix all of the ingredients except the softened butter in a bowl with a spatula, dough whisk and/or your hands. Let rest for 10 minutes, then transfer to your countertop and knead by hand, adding 2 Tbsp of butter at a time, kneading between butter additions until the butter is incorporated and the dough stays together. Now follow the instructions above from when you transfer the dough to a lightly oiled bowl and start the bulk fermentation.
I actually changed up the instructions a tiny bit and we hand mixed. I mixed all the wet ingredients including adding melted butter together and dissolved the tangzhong and added the firm starter. Next I added the flour and mixed. Finally slap and folds were done by my niece until a good windowpane was attained.
Comments
But I can't figure out how you got the weights you mention . It says 899g but then you say `1470g. Can you clarify? I have a 13" pull man and would like to make the correct amount for that pan. Thank you Bennie. c
Caroline sorry for the confusion the measurements at the top are for my 9x4 pullman but the body of the post was written by Melissa and I obviously didn’t edit it which I have done now. For your 9x13 pullman
Ingredients
Sweet Stiff Starter
Tangzhong
Final Dough
Pre-bake Wash
Post-bake Wash
I hope that helps. That is the original recipe that Melissa shared.
Benny
I should have figured that out myself. Will definitely be making it.c
Nice to see you here Caroline, I hope you give it a try. Not sure if you make a lot of enriched doughs, but sometimes my starter has difficulty with the sugar and butter and the dough will ferment slowly. I will sometimes just add a pinch of IDY, literally a small pinch to compensate for the yeast not being osmotolerant. I hope you share you bake!
Benny
Yeast water loves the enriched doughs. I have great success rising my Challah with YW . I feed it 1/2 an apple and leave it in a warm place overnight. It’s fizzy and fragrant and does a great job with enriched breads. I will let you know. c
That’s good to know Caroline thanks for sharing that with me.
I can imagine how soft and tasty it is! Wish I could have a slice now!
Yippee
I would gladly share Yippee.
Benny
That's a very nice looking loaf, so soft with a golden colour. Great baking.
Cheers,
Gavin
Thank you Gavin, there were some challenges such as using my nieces starter and flours and baking in their oven which I’ve never used before. However, all in all it was a successful bake which was polished off at lunch by everyone in the household.
Benny
Here I am messing around with so many other bakes when I could easily make a pillowy soft milk loaf. Thanks for sharing your recipe Benny, I’ve bookmarked it. One question though, there are recipes using only egg whites whereas there’s whole egg in yours. Does your loaf appear yellowish (assuming that’s why the other recipes used only whites)?
-ConfusedChristi 🤣
Christi, that’s funny because I haven’t seen recipes that use only egg whites. The crumb really didn’t look yellowish, not that I could see. Since there is just barely over one egg in the recipe there really isn’t a lot of egg in it.
Benny
You should be very happy with how this came out. It looks perfect for this type of bake. I will have to finally give this a go for my wife who I know would enjoy this type of bread. There are certainly endless variations you could try as well.
Happy baking Benny.
Thank you Ian, I was very pleased with this bake. Considering it was made using my niece’s starter and her flour in her parents’ oven I’m surprised how well it turned out. You should give it a try, everyone loved it and it was gone within minutes of it being sliced.
Benny
Hi Benny,
I'm aware this is an old post, so I hope you will still somehow see it.
I made this yesterday, and it turned out soft, but not fluffy and shreddable. Based on your experience, is this due to insufficient first rise, or insufficient kneading? My dough was very wet, so I kneaded a little less than desired, resorting to s&f during the rise.
Another technical question: for most yeasted versions of hokkaido milk bread, the first rise is typically at least 100%. Why do we terminate this earlier for sourdough versions? Is it to reduce the sour tang?
Many thanks for reading this and for sharing so many great tips and recipes.
Best, Lin
Hi Lin
Insufficient dough development will definitely contribute to less softness and shreddability. You might want to reduce the hydration a bit if your dough seemed wet. Typically my hokkaido milk breads are lowish hydration and won’t feel wet for the flours that I use. You flours may be different, so start with less milk. Also make sure you do windowpane testing as your dough is kneading. Don’t add the butter until the dough is at least moderately developed if you are adding soft (not melted) butter.
Sourdough breads are quite different from yeasted ones. As you know as they ferment they will become more acidic due to the production and growth of the LAB. Yes we don’t want this bread to be acidic so we don’t ferment excessively. However, as you know, the more acidic the dough gets the more gluten breakdown occurs. So in general we don’t usually allow wheat based sourdough breads to double in bulk fermentation as we would commercial yeast doughs. Commercial yeast doughs won’t have much LAB in them other than what might be in the flour so they won’t acidify as quickly as they ferment.
Hope your next bake turns out better for you. I have updated my milk bread formulas, you might want to look at a newer version.
Happy baking
Benny
Hi Benny,
Thanks so much for your very helpful reply. I will reduce the hydration for the next loaf and persevere with the kneading.
I have a follow-up question about the reduced first rise for sourdough milk breads. For most yeasted versions, the at least 100% first rise contributes to both the development of flavour due to the fermentation but also the development of gluten strength so that it can rise well in the oven eventually without cracking. Am I right to assume that we don't really have to think so much about insufficient gluten development with a reduced first rise for sourdough milk breads because the extended BF+final rise duration (about 6-10 hours) takes care of it?
Thanks so much for putting together your index of bakes. I've read through many of them, and decided to start with the most basic sourdough milk bread with white flour to understand the process better. Once I get it, I will try to incorporate some nuts and whole wheat (cf your latest walnut pepita whole wheat loaf).
Lin
You are correct in that fermentation ie time will help with gluten development. But for this style of bread, I think it really benefits from full gluten development up front if you want to attain the texture you desire. Many sourdough breads that I make do not require such intense gluten development, for example baguettes because you want a more open crumb which is not a goal for a Hokkaido milk bread.
I hope that helps.
Benny
Thank you, Benny. Extremely helpful. I will press on with the baking!
Greetings from Belgium.
Lin